Talk:Classical music
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[edit] Timeline of composers
the timeline is hideous 82.194.62.200 (talk) 03:56, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
This timeline is so typographically ugly that I think it's best to remove it altogether. In any case I'm taking it off the article for the present. Comments? --Kleinzach 01:50, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
- Can you help me with this timeline? I wanted to add messiaen but it went wrong. See the history to see what i mean. 85.146.24.65 (talk) 03:08, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
The timeline is ugly, but it was helpful. I feel strongly that removing it was a mistake, and I think it should be reinstated. If no one disagrees with me, I'm going to put it back. 64.122.56.143 (talk) 03:37, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
- I disagree. As the previous person said it's hideous. Of course if you can fix it that would be excellent, but in its present form it discredits the encyclopedia. Thanks. --Kleinzach 03:49, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
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- I don't have the knowledge to fix it, otherwise I would. Although Kleinzach makes a good point about the unattractiveness of the timeline, it isn't doing anyone any good by taking it down. I specifically come to this entry to look at that timeline, and frequently, as it's useful to see how the lifetimes of different composers overlap. Anyway, I'd like to get some feedback on this issue. It definitely needs improvement, but the question is, do we leave it up in its current state until it's modified? Or do we take it down completely? I think this should be decided based on more than the opinion of two people. 64.122.56.143 (talk) 22:44, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
I put the time line back up again since no one's made it better yet. I like the timeline, ugly or not. It's helpful. -- Sarah 97.116.23.44 (talk) 06:55, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
- Can you tell me what it is helpful for? That way we can think of the best way to fix it. --Kleinzach 07:52, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
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- I'll bite. It's useful as a guide to people who aren't familiar with classical music, and don't understand the temporal relationships between various composers and composition styles (information I don't think is readily apparent elsewhere in this article). I grew up immersed in the stuff, and I'm sometimes surprised by who was writing what when (and by how much I don't know...).
- That said, should this be replaced by {{Timeline_Classical_Composers_Famous}}, also seen in List of classical music composers? (The main difference is that it only covers Renaissance to Romantic.) Alternatively, it could be removed, and replaced by a {{further}} (or similar template) pointing to the composer lists at an appropriate place. Magic♪piano 14:37, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
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- A graphic showing temporal relationships could be worthwhile. Unfortunately the present one is typographically so inept. and in any case so truncated, that I don't think anything meaningful can be seen. Many minor names are included: Harant, Torelli, Bortniansky etc. We are also up against the width of the screen which makes large graphics difficult to use. I agree {{Timeline_Classical_Composers_Famous}} is preferable to the one at the top of the page. --Kleinzach 04:05, 29 October 2008 (UTC)
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- I think there is enough meaningful information within the graph to justify its existence, ugly though it is (e.g. one can see that Beethoven was born before Mozart died). I am in complete agreement with Kleinzach that this timeline can be greatly improved; however, this is not my area of expertise, so I don't think I can help with the creation of a new or improved graph.64.122.56.143 (talk) 01:55, 4 November 2008 (UTC)
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- As I see it, the problem is that there are too many names. I did a bit of hunting online for a good timeline, but I couldn't find one. The best ones to me are timelines like http://www.danmansmusic.com/composers.htm which have far too many names to be displayed graphically.
- Therefore, I think we should re-do the timeline so that there are only about 30 or so major composers (maybe chosen by a poll) and then somehow make the timeline harder to change or even lock it. I don't know enough about Wikipedia to know how to lock this, whether it can be locked, or whether it is something that is lock-worthy; maybe locking is going too far and is violating Wikipedia's core principles. I think people keep adding one or two names each, thinking that they are being helpful, when actually the composers they are adding are far too minor for this timeline. Squandermania (talk) 19:03, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
This timeline is absurdly incomplete and suspiciously biased and I wonder why. And I don't say about absence of some composer more or less important. I'm saying about trascendental importance of composer for the development of classical music. For example: The 3 great influential teachers and pioneers of organ music were Antonio de Cabezón, Jan Pieterszoon Sweelinck & Girolamo Frescobaldi. Cabezón is the only that doesn't appear. The Renaissance Giants (Byrd, Josquin, Palestrina, Tallis & Victoria) neither Victoria nor Tallis are showed. The most important composer of Medieval Age music and the author of the earliest known complete setting of the Ordinary Mass Guillaume de Machaut is ignored. Is more important for classical music Gerald Palm, Harry Partch or Stockhausen than Victoria? Absolutely not. Certainly ridiculous. Bizarre 06:22, 18 March 2009 88.3.253.46
[edit] Nationalism and whatnot
"There was also a rise within Europe, ... as composers such as Edvard Grieg, Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov, and Antonín Dvořák echoed traditional music of their homelands in their compositions."
I don't think Rimsky-Korsakov was European. But I don't know how to change the sentence and make it sound good. Should this mention all of Могучая кучка instead of just one of them? I mean, their whole point was to make nationalistic music, and it seems kind of silly to single out one just one. 128.194.39.250 (talk) 00:59, 15 April 2009 (UTC)
[edit] Link
Could http://www.classicalmusichomepage.com be added to the list of URLs? It is a great resource with classical music news, reviews, jobs and lots of reference materials. Thanks. Ndifrancesco (talk) 11:13, 22 May 2009 (UTC)
